For Lurkers and Newbies regarding C&Cs...Add on to APs p

[TheBug]

This is stemming from a conversation I've been having with Blinkblnk (Give it hell Blake can't wait to see your progression).

This is also an add on to AlteredPilots post. http://sketchkult.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=6014

This has been posted so many times that I think it no longer resembles a horse.....If you are serious about getting better, the BEST thing you can do is keep at it. I've told others this...DO THE LINE DRILLS (all the good ones did and might still do on occasion), READ THE NEWBIE SECTION (most on your answers are there). When you reach the point of madness, all of a sudden you start to see the fruits of your labor and THEN realize just how much MORE practice you need just to be FAIR at this craft. I started almost 2 years ago and still haven't laid lines on a car. I've done helmets and one friends bike (which makes me cringe when I see it) and a celtic knot on another bike that still gets me jazzed when I see it. Take your time, practice and have fun. Make it about passion not money (there IS a standard for this work) or praise. Jump through the hoops post pics of progress and DON'T get discouraged. If you can pick up a brush and pull killer lines down the side of a car without doing any of the above you are freak of nature and need to be studied.

On the C&C issue. Recently I have seen a few people post a few pics and then gripe about not getting C&Cs (which drives me insane). I can only speak for myself here BUT don't expect C&C on your first posts. Chances are you can figure out what you need to work on just by comparing what you did to the work of the awesome masters on this site, you know the ones that make you shit Twinkies® and wet yourself. There have been alot of people who post afew pics expect comments and kudos for beginner work and then you never hear from them again. So I'm sorry if I come across a little rude and again I'm only speaking for myself, But it's almost like wasting breath and time to crit on a newbie UNTIL you see that they are really trying and are willing to put in the time and effort. ESPECIALLY since most of the answers are in the NEWBIE section. That might seem kind of snobby but oh well. Suck it up. Once I (people?) see that you are putting in the time and your work starts to improve you will find that I (as well as most of the folks here?) will be more than willing to pat you the back while picking apart your work. I'm still jumping through hoops myself and I also get a 'lil discouraged when nobody crits my stuff...BUT...then I look at my stuff and see what could have made it better and then try to outdo it.

Stay with it and keep posting your pics. That includes of your line drills to.

Peace, Grease and Paint.

Thanks for listening to me vent.
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[The Buddha]

To follow up on the C&C's - look at em as perks, great when ya get em but not to be expected. I understand the feelsing though - when you put all your effort into something then face your fears to put it out in public, its a big deal. You want people to check it out and give you feed back. I know when I post stuff I check it religiously to see if drew any responses.

But in a practical sense there's a TON of work posted here. Our stuff gets lost in the crowd often times. Every now n then something you do will get feedback - enjoy it. But if you dont - dont sweat it, it isnt rejection, it just didnt catch someone's eye. Comments are the exception not the rule - look at the number of views/per replies for everybody.

Keep on keepin on.
Cheers
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LowBrow 4 Life

[badace]

I'll throw in my two cents, I like c/c's as much as anyone, but with the sheer volume of work posted on here, we cant write a large critique of everyones work, ESPECIALLY the guys posting early, early work.

Look at it this way, everyone's first lines look the same. Some people have a natural inclination for design work, or some for line quality, some have neither, but what it boil down to, is we have seen your work before. Look through other people's first work posts to get an idea of what you need to work on, which is available in the newbie section anyway.

Just hang in there and be creative! Notice the most creative work gets the most comments. Even the most perfect lines dont get much feedback if they are boring.

Ace
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[MrScary]

If people are going to gripe about C&C then they shouldnt ask for it.
Myself I do ask for it. If its good or bad at least its the truth. The best way to get better is for people to look at your work and find out what your doing wrong and point it out. Im a rookie at this and the only place that I get any feed back s this forum, Which I must say is the most active with top notch striper's. And what better forum of C&C to get from?
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ALL C & C are welcome,

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[Joey Madden]

The bottom line

Most people cannot handle the truth

Granted I don't always use diplomacy but at least I always give my best critiques and help to those who confront me in person, in an email or by phone and believe me I get a lot of calls. I know I've helped many just from my website which has been on the Net for 12 years. I try my best to help those who really want to get it together like Anthony White who is in constant touch with me. I never expect anything in return as long as they don't rake me through the coals.

Thats all I have to say.
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[alteredpilot]

hey Joey...

my wife keeps telling me ....

"its not what you say, its how you say it"

[TBonez]

Im behind ya 100% Joey. Problum is the written word does not come off as well as the spoken word. My advise.......take the C&C with a grain of salt and use it to your advantage to work harder at getting better.
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[4everblue]

Learning any part of this craft takes time, and lots of it. Think of it as learning a new language. You have to get a lot of the basics down before you can start understanding anything. Lettering has a ton of rules to follow, it's a pain but it's also easier to figure out because of those rules and guidelines. With striping, at least design wise, there are almost no written rules, in fact, in the 30 years I've been learning striping, I can only recall reading one (1) written rule about designs and that was regarding crossovers and how they should't be made at shallow angles.

Like the others have said, stick with it and don't expect to pick it up overnight. Study the basics. When looking at pics on here or PHL, forget the flashy designs, but rather pay especially close attention to the simple designs that get a lot of comments. Study these designs very closely as this is the hardest to pull off. You can always add flash to the basics.

[JoeyTOOLZ]

Great post, Bug! "Do your line drills and practice yo' ass off!" That's about the best advice anyone can give a newbie -- or even an intermediate level striper, for that matter!
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[kustomkeifer]

Thanks up front for all of the amazing contributions (art and otherwise) from ALL members of ALL skill levels in ALL mediums.

Time to re-cap the rules??? Perhaps...
Here they are from the Boss' Mouth....

The SketchKult Artists' Forum is an evolving network of artists from a variety of genres (comics, lowbrow, pin-up, fine art, illustration, sculpture, design, etc.) who post their work, discuss issues, and exchange comments and criticism. The goal of the Forum is to encourage camaraderie among talented people via positive interaction.

SketchKult invites artists of all levels to join the Forum. For this reason, please observe the following rules…

1. Please maintain a professional tone when making comments. Remember, this is a friendly and positive community. Think before you respond and remember that words in print usually come across stronger than spoken words.

2. Please refrain from personally attacking any members. Breaking this rule will result in being banned from the SketchKult Artists' Forum.

3. Always include a WARNING in your topic header if your post contains graphic content beyond simple nudes. Not everyone is comfortable with graphic content. Please be considerate.

4. By all means please self promote. Do so tactfully and discreetly. Avoid "Spamming" the board.

5. Observe the Golden Rule: "Treat others as you would like them to treat you" (see below)

Personal opinion vs. constructive criticism.

Please to continue to contribute your tremendous talents to the forum, but remember to teach ART and not PHILOSOPHY. In the end you aren't nurturing young talent that way (and some of your comments may inadvertently insult other members not even involved in the dialogue). Remember that the written word can easily be taken more harshly than intended. Without your facial expressions and body language signals get crossed. That's just the way it is...

Just be cool. Some people's skin isn't as thick as yours may be.

FROM NOW ON send your more potentially misread advice/opinions via PM to the other artists and not subject them to possible "public" embarrassment. This way I don't have to feel like I'm censoring your efforts, and no one gets hurt. This is the new policy for personal opinions that don't classify as constructive criticism. ALL OFFENDING POSTS WILL BE DELETED, NO EXCEPTIONS.

You can still go on for ten paragraphs about a crooked nose on a pin-up girl (or what have you), and what you would do to fix it. That type of criticism can be just as hard on a "sensitive artist", but I will defend it to the end. That kind of heat makes things grow, not shrink and die.

I know some may ask " who decides what's constructive?...I do! LOL!
Many people thank me about the content and "tone" of this board, and have abandoned bigger "better" boards to join our little group. I'd like to think my moderation and direction has a little something to do with it (as well as an incredibly selfless, sharing, generous, and talented membership). As I've said before, thanks to all of you who have made sketchkult the great place it is.

As far as feuds between artists, bannings, unbannings, and so on....I will edit any references past, present or otherwise referring to them. All negative, destructive, rude, crude, obnoxious conetent....you get the point?

YES, I edit posts. And NO this is not a democracy.

Here's a good rule>>>

Love your neighbor as yourself....
1 Corinthians 13:4
Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

Not an easy one, but worth striving to achieve.

That God guy could really write some good stuff
Enough PHILOSOPHY...On with the ART!!!
KK

****TOPIC OFFICIALLY LOCKED****
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